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Greyone Greyone is a male
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Question Crank up the volume ! Reply to this Post Post Reply with Quote Edit/Delete Posts Report Post to a Moderator       Go to the top of this page

when i listen to professional tracks , they allways sound much louder then mine and still having a fair dynamic range.

compression isnt the solution (louder it its indeed , but it sounds crap then)

i cant seem to pump the volume up without going in the red area (db meter)

What do you guys use , and whats the best solution for my problem.
23-10-2005 18:10 Send an Email to Greyone Search for Posts by Greyone Add Greyone to your Buddy List
Haze Haze is a male
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RE: Crank up the volume ! Reply to this Post Post Reply with Quote Edit/Delete Posts Report Post to a Moderator       Go to the top of this page

quote:
Originally posted by greyone
when i listen to professional tracks , they allways sound much louder then mine and still having a fair dynamic range.

compression isnt the solution (louder it its indeed , but it sounds crap then)

i cant seem to pump the volume up without going in the red area (db meter)

What do you guys use , and whats the best solution for my problem.


yeah

i'm using waves L2 or L1 ultramaximizer+ for that
or you can use any other limiter Bigup

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This post has been edited 1 time(s), it was last edited by Haze: 23-10-2005 18:41.

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cynik cynik is a male
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RE: Crank up the volume ! Reply to this Post Post Reply with Quote Edit/Delete Posts Report Post to a Moderator       Go to the top of this page

quote:
Originally posted by greyone
when i listen to professional tracks , they allways sound much louder then mine and still having a fair dynamic range.

compression isnt the solution (louder it its indeed , but it sounds crap then)

i cant seem to pump the volume up without going in the red area (db meter)

What do you guys use , and whats the best solution for my problem.


well, they use professional mixing studios with professional engeneers working in them.. that's why it's for. you can ofcourse use compression on the master channel but in slight amounts... but in a situation where you take your stuff to be mastered, they will ask for an almost dry (no effects) mixdown anyway.

another thing, if your levels are off, no amount of compression can make it better, only worse. so best bet would be getting the levels as even as possible

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23-10-2005 20:10 Send an Email to cynik Homepage of cynik Search for Posts by cynik Add cynik to your Buddy List
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or you could do what most sensible people that know their limitations do....

get your mix sounding good with no compression or limiting on the master channel, then leave it to a mastering engineer to go to work on, ez innit, and i gaurentee you it will sound so much better if you take it to the right place, and no you wont have to re mortgage your house.
24-10-2005 02:41
Surora23 Surora23 is a male
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quote:
Originally posted by MUNKI C
or you could do what most sensible people that know their limitations do....

get your mix sounding good with no compression or limiting on the master channel, then leave it to a mastering engineer to go to work on, ez innit, and i gaurentee you it will sound so much better if you take it to the right place, and no you wont have to re mortgage your house.



lol

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Darkside Darkside is a male
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yeah...you wanna learn how to do it yourself, better start savin up for classes.
it all seems like a bunch of magic tricks to us eh?
24-10-2005 04:45 Send an Email to Darkside Search for Posts by Darkside Add Darkside to your Buddy List
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try Fruity blood overdrive on your master , sounds incrediblily louder and the high decibel-peaksl wont go in the red area .
24-10-2005 09:41 Send an Email to Greyone Search for Posts by Greyone Add Greyone to your Buddy List
cynik cynik is a male
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quote:
Originally posted by greyone
try Fruity blood overdrive on your master , sounds incrediblily louder and the high decibel-peaksl wont go in the red area .


lol. and makes it sound like shit!

what you have to master are the EQ settings.. make it sound loud without the compressor/maximizer. then, if you really want to go into it, separate the signal to at least 3 different frequency ranges and compress each range individually. that's how it's done in pro studios, offcourse a substitute for that would be a good multiband compressor. and blood overdrive isn't one aint it!!

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24-10-2005 10:01 Send an Email to cynik Homepage of cynik Search for Posts by cynik Add cynik to your Buddy List
Greyone Greyone is a male
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actualy it works as a compressor , it squashes the signal n makes it louder

"Blood provides overdrive distortion and handles it using classic techniques that give it the compressed and soft sounds, as opposed to the harsh sound produced by many guitar overdrive plugins."

This post has been edited 1 time(s), it was last edited by Greyone: 24-10-2005 10:14.

24-10-2005 10:11 Send an Email to Greyone Search for Posts by Greyone Add Greyone to your Buddy List
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I didn't say it's not. but really, it's a weak attempt at a compressor. in time, I doubt you'll stick to using it. have you checked waves c4 for example ?

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24-10-2005 10:22 Send an Email to cynik Homepage of cynik Search for Posts by cynik Add cynik to your Buddy List
Greyone Greyone is a male
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no , maybe i'll try it if i find it , n if i have the time.
24-10-2005 10:52 Send an Email to Greyone Search for Posts by Greyone Add Greyone to your Buddy List
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I think the best solution for a louder mix is to really fill out the frequency spectrum, the fuller the sound is the louder it appears to be.
Rather than compressing at the end you should be using a limiter and bring everything up till your just outside the red.
I dont know if anyome else has found this, but I seem to get different results when using different burning software. Media player seems to burn quite quietly, but Ive been using sonic stage mastering studio which seems to burn CDs at a much louder volume (Without any FX ).
I think it might also depend on the quality of the CDs your using but Im not sure.
But the main point is to really fill out the frequency range as this increases the perceived volume significantly.

This post has been edited 1 time(s), it was last edited by TechDiff: 24-10-2005 14:18.

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Surora23 Surora23 is a male
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quote:
Originally posted by TechDiff
I think the best solution for a louder mix is to really fill out the frequency spectrum, the fuller the sound is the louder it appears to be.
Rather than compressing at the end you should be using a limiter and bring everything up till your just outside the red.
I dont know if anyome else has found this, but I seem to get different results when using different burning software. Media player seems to burn quite quietly, but Ive been using sonic stage mastering studio which seems to burn CDs at a much louder volume (Without any FX ).
I think it might also depend on the quality of the CDs your using but Im not sure.
But the main point is to really fill out the frequency range as this increases the perceived volume significantly.


ive had teh waves platinum bundle for a while...agreed

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24-10-2005 14:20 Send an Email to Surora23 Search for Posts by Surora23 Add Surora23 to your Buddy List
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quote:
Originally posted by Darkside
yeah...you wanna learn how to do it yourself, better start savin up for classes.
it all seems like a bunch of magic tricks to us eh?



lol.....fuckin voodoo magic man!!!!!

in all seriousness just have a look on the records you own, how many say mastered by the actual artist?? produced, programmed, engineered etc etc......very rarely mastered. go and check out the heathmans website......if its good enuff for total science its good enough for me

This post has been edited 1 time(s), it was last edited by utter muppet: 24-10-2005 15:02.

24-10-2005 15:01
OgO OgO is a male
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Wink RE: Crank up the volume ! Reply to this Post Post Reply with Quote Edit/Delete Posts Report Post to a Moderator       Go to the top of this page

Hi, maybe i am little late with the help, but take time to read this it might help. But remember that you need to make good construction first(quality samples for example) then to mix them and finlize the project(don't buy samples and just putting them in your mix, it isn't fun, believe me).

First i am sure that you have heard and even tried the process called "DITHERING". So, the secret lies here. The process is simple, but confusing for they who don't know a littlebit about binary system (1s and 0s). You now ask your self what the hell is talking this guy about...
Well, 44,100 Hz 16 bit has some meaning to you, and what about 44,100 Hz 24 bit?
When you record live or synthesize some drum, snare or whatever, ALWAYS record and save them in 24 bit resolution (the sampling rate isn't important in this tut). The 24bit resolution means that the sound is processed by combination of 2 square 24 1s&0s/second(If you need more reference on this just write me PM and i will help you with more deep explanation).
The dithering process also is used in the imaging. The next comparsion will help you create an image of what dithering exactly is. Imagine that there is a nice looking picture saved with over 16milion colors and we convert (truncate) it in two colors(2bits), black and white. When we look at the picture, from nice 3D looking picture, now we see a 2D image of the object. Then we start to paint dots(pixels) around every single line of that object, around every corner etc, or if you want, we make a process called shading. So the picture now will have shadows on it and around it and it will be found more in space of that 2bit look. Now let we go back to the sound dithering process. Like the image shading, this will be made with noise applying (there are two or three types of noises in the dithering process). Then when you record the mix with dithering it will truncate the 24 bit resolution to 16bit and the magic noise which will make the sound to be heard to 96db bellow zero. This process is to make great CD quality image of your mix and to sound as you liked. This is not everything i mentioned about dithering but the general description is geaven. The most important is to understand that the sound dithering process is same as shading pictures (applying low db noise to the sound that makes it magic Smile ).
You may use L2 or L1 Ultramaximizer, or even much better is to use the Wavelab's ditherer. There you will see what types of noises you can apply by observing the sound with the FFT analyzer.
Also, don't forget to expand the HighEndFreq (7kHz - 16kHz) field around 6db over the 0 if there is lack of freshness in the mix. This is important too.
That's it.

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u can also export the project as it is (not loud) as a 44,100hz, 16bit wav (or higher) and then load it into some wave editor (like audacity).
Then normalize the whole thing, put the volume a bit higher (mostly +3 db is enough) and export it again from there.

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Surya Surya is a male
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Wouldn't that final 3db boost make the high frequencies clip? Just normalize and then limit.

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quote:
Originally posted by Surya
Wouldn't that final 3db boost make the high frequencies clip? Just normalize and then limit.

depends from track to track with me
I just boost the volume till just under the level where it starts to clip

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Surora23 Surora23 is a male
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RE: Crank up the volume ! Reply to this Post Post Reply with Quote Edit/Delete Posts Report Post to a Moderator       Go to the top of this page

quote:
Originally posted by greyone
when i listen to professional tracks , they allways sound much louder then mine and still having a fair dynamic range.

compression isnt the solution (louder it its indeed , but it sounds crap then)

i cant seem to pump the volume up without going in the red area (db meter)

What do you guys use , and whats the best solution for my problem.


i disagree...ive read a few professional intereviews such as one with ram trilogy and andy c stated that its all about the COMPRESSION ON THE MIX not individual parts...

ive recently been adding compression to my tracks after remastering them in wav lab...sprry to burst your bubbles guys...but thats an important touch...


p.s. if you dont have a substantial multiband compressor...then forget it...

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This post has been edited 1 time(s), it was last edited by Surora23: 12-03-2006 18:23.

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J. Wells J. Wells is a male
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Lots of good advice. I prefer to send the entire mix through a set of scientific filters first, to cut down on "trouble frequencies," then an expander, compressor (liiiiightly mind you), and a brick wall limiter last. It's also useful to phase-flip one of your frequency spectrums, like the mids or highs (this adds more headroom). Also, try taking your final mix and kicking either the left or right channel forward by a tiny amount of time (like 3-5/100ths of a second) to help open up the stereo field. Or just run it through a plugin that will do it for you. You can also do that to individual tracks, but I don't recommend it for anything too rhythmic like drums, or heavily centred sounds, like basslines. (I should prolly mention that you shouldn't stack too many of these tricks on top of one another, of course. )

All the best studio tricks in the world still don't compare to what a mastering engineer can do in half an hour, though. Mastering is what gives music that clean, shiny "pro" sound. And no, I don't know how to do that. It's voodoo of the darkest kind. Tongue

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